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Posted: Fri Oct 05, 2007 1:33 am
by pml
Matthieu: hopefully there won't be too much overlap between our efforts thus far. I'll be redrafting the project page shortly to make it into a proper table, and one of the columns of the table will allow contributors to list volumes they already have worked on.

If you refer to the list on the project page, at present, I have volumes 1–15, 43–55, and 65–78 complete, as both single PDFs as well as the component PDFs from the DME site, usually with the accompanying Kritischer Bericht (exceptions: 7, 8, 43-46, 74, and 77).

However, I tend to the view that there is not really a need for the Kritischer Bericht reports to be uploaded to IMSLP, as the editions usually stand by themselves. I would also refrain from posting the prefatory matter, since it also will contain the majority of editorial matter rather than music, and the presence of facsimiles tend to bump up the file size unacceptably.

Feldmahler: yes, it will be festina lente, and I'll probably try to tidy up or rationalise the various existing Mozart pages as we go. At present IMSLP mainly has scans of the orchestral/concerto/chamber works, so I suspect it would be worthwhile to concentrate on the vocal works to begin with. :-)

Posted: Fri Oct 05, 2007 6:08 am
by Matthieu
Nice !
Here is the list of volumes I completed: 1-3, 46-89, 92,93 (single pdf volumes). You can add me to the table and cross our lists !

Quality of scans in DME

Posted: Sat Oct 06, 2007 1:13 pm
by Vivaldi
To Matthieu and Mr P. Legge, although I'm new to IMSLP I have known and downloaded the PDF files from the Digital Mozart Edition of the Neue Mozart Ausgabe. I contacted Feldmahler about the unsatisfactory quality regarding the PDF files. For example, in Le Nozze di Figaro edited by Ludwig Finscher, there are a lot of pages where the music scan is quite faint, almost equivalent of under-inking in standard music printing. For vocal music, the libretto are sometimes not clearly displayed because of the previous reason stated. There are also some vertical and horizontal gaps caused by moving the page while it is being scanned. Finally, some of the pages are tilted.
I would like to know how did you clean up the PDF files and which software did you use? When you say cleaning up, do you address the problems with the scans I mentioned above?
Mr Legge, I assume you need the information regarding the date of birth, date of death and nationality of the editors in the NMA. I'd be wiling to help.

Posted: Sun Oct 07, 2007 4:16 am
by Carolus
Another possible copyright angle for some of the earlier (pre-1964) volumes of the NMA would be to check on their US copyright status. Quite a few of the columes from the 1950s and early 1960s were not renewed in the USA and were ineligible for GATT restoration due to their public domain status in Germany. (The USA considers the "country of origin" to be the country where the "copyright claimant" - almost always the publisher - is located.)

Perusing the Kalmus and Masters catalogues gives a good indication of which items were not renewed. The H. C. Robbins-Landon eds. of the Jupiter Symphony and some others were definitely not renewed, as were a number of the volumes edited by Gerhard Croll. Since Canada defines country of origin as the nationality of the editor, the Robbins-Landon works that were not renewed in the USA would be free in Canada as well. A work by a Scandinavian editor that was not renewed would have to be hosted in the US server.

New website for downloading NMA

Posted: Sun Oct 07, 2007 10:17 am
by Vivaldi
Hi, just something related to the original topic. I've found another (mirror?) website that allows downloading of the NMA:

The layout may not be as nice as the DME but at least you can just right-click on the link to download the files straightaway.

Posted: Sat Nov 03, 2007 2:09 pm
by pml
Report on the status of the acquirement of volumes from the NMA:

Firstly, while we wait for the IMSLP to re-open, the NMA incorporation project will move ahead slowly in preparation. Despite the current lack of the IMSLP wiki, there are tasks that can be achieved currently which I will be actioning over the next few months.

As project leader I would like to personally thank all those who have already contibuted much useful information and assistance: in no particular order, Carolus, Matthieu, and Vivaldi (and his friend), especially amongst others.

Anyone who may be able to assist with the project as it currently stands is warmly invited to contact me for more information: either email me (rochorus AT gmail DOT com) or use the forums' personal messaging link.

Regards, Philip

Posted: Thu Oct 30, 2008 10:26 am
by pml
Bump: ... rt_Ausgabe

I have updated the NMA project page over the last day marking volumes in bold black and red colours to indicate their current status. Basically, if the volume number is bolded, it is entirely permissible to include at IMSLP; the ones marked in red are still under various copyright protections.

I had initially thought to mark only the editions that are urtext with a German citizen as editor and was published in Germany more than 25 years ago; which is basically a home run, thanks to the Berne Rule of the Shorter Term. For non-German citizens I have been slightly more conservative in assuming the 93/98 EC Copyright Directive limits copyright in urtext editions to a maximum 30 year term from the date of publication.

The good news is that three-quarters of the 101 volumes that make up series 1 through to 9 have entered the PD according to those two criteria.

However, I would like to approach the Internationale Stiftung Mozarteum to gain permission to host all 101 volumes (and some of the appendices). If we don't obtain permission, then uploaded PDFs will probably have to have the Internationale Stiftung Mozarteum [ISM] footers removed.

Presumably IMSLP would have to host all of the musical portion under the same conditions as per their site notice, viz: "I agree to use this web site only for personal study and not to make copies except for my personal use under "Fair Use" principles of Copyright law".

I haven't dealt with such high-powered organisations as the ISM very often, and I thought I would post a draft of the "sort" of letter we should offer; comments welcome.

To: Internationale Stiftung Mozarteum, Salzburg

The IMSLP (Petrucci Music Library) website aims to be a repository of the world's printed music, for both public domain works and licensed copyright works where permission has been granted by rights holders;

we admire the vision the ISM has, to make Wolfgang Amadeus Mozart's entire life work widely available on-line at their DME website, viewable or downloadable for personal use;

as this is a goal we share, in wanting to make Mozart's music as widely available as possible, and as we are cognizant of the negotiations between the ISM and Bärenreiter to license the scores of the Neue Mozart Ausgabe for the DME website, we would in turn like to ask ISM for permission to host a subset of the DME scores under the exact same conditions of personal and private use.

We believe this would have many benefits:

the IMSLP is becoming a very well-known website, and the DME website already has no doubt gained a number of hits redirected from us, as we recognise that the DME is now the de facto standard for on-line representation of Mozart's work;

the DME website has occasionally struggled to serve pages and scores, and the IMSLP's hosting of a substantial portion of the PDFs would lower the ISM’s server costs to run the site;

certain of the scans (e.g. Il nozze di Figaro) are of noticeably lower quality than others and we would be interested in assisting with upgrading and correcting problematic scores in the DME collection.

In wishing to host the substantially musical portion of the NMA (perhaps not the critical reports and prefaces), we are aware that copyright has already lapsed in certain individual volumes. We are not nearly as interested in doubling up in mere piecemeal fashion and in wishing to host the complete musical corpus we are genuinely interested in collaboration.

Lastly, IMSLP may be able to assist in providing a distributed team of proof-readers who could conceivably assist with the ISM's long-term goal of improving the performing materials of the NMA, which have already been rendered slightly out-of-date by ongoing scholarship in Mozart research since the inception of the NMA in 1955.

Regards, Philip

Posted: Mon Nov 03, 2008 5:54 am
by Carolus
A minor clarification about the Kritischer Berichten. Unlike the music, these are original works of their author/editors and thus subject to a normal life-plus 50 years copyright term in Canada. I don't know if there any any NMA editors who have been dead for more than 50 years.

The country of origin is most likely that of the copyright claimant, which for all volumes is Baerenreiter Verlag, headquartered in Kassel, Germany, as opposed to the country of origin of the individual volume's editor. Germany has a 25-year term from publication for such Urtext and Critical editions, which means that any music volume published 1983 or earlier is public domain in its country of origin (Germany) as of 1/1/09 and thus free to post at IMSLP (as the red-and-black chart appears to indicate). The music volumes would be protected for no more than 30 years from publication elsewhere in the EU - if explicitly provided for in a given country's statutes, but only 20 years in Italy (for example).

Posted: Mon Nov 03, 2008 7:26 am
by pml
Thanks Carolus,

My mistake regarding the Kritischer Berichten. I thought these were subject to some of the urtext ruling, so I'll amend the table sometime. Although the earliest possible year for a life+50 term to expire would have been 2011 for a single author, that editor's co-author lived a good deal beyond 1960. It seems the first of the Kritischer Berichten to enter the PD in Canada under those terms will be volumes 48 and 79 in 2013.

Regards, PML

Update: the table now has a note regarding the correct information regarding the Critical Reports.

May I request two things:
1) I would really like comments on the general form of the draft letter to the ISM above. At the moment I would even prefer harsh criticism to NO criticism!
2) By all means sign up for contributing to this on the project page, indicating which volumes of the DME you have already downloaded or intend to. Some are already marked "Pml, Matthieu", so it doesn't matter if there is more than one potential contributor.

However, I don't want to start doing bulk uploads until we've contacted the DME for permission, and I've written the style guide. The need isn't there to rush at this, since the DME website has been quite stable for some time, and (if you are patient enough) you can get hold of virtually anything required from there.

Out of date info: refer to the more recent posts in the thread. (Lastly, I'm currently working through series II (2) and series X (10); the volumes already done by me are:
1–18, 22–31, 37, 38, 43–55, 65–79, and 102–113.
The last I heard from Matthieu, the volumes that had not doubled up were:
56–64, 80–89, and 92–93.
Thus, the volumes still "up for grabs" (excluding ones still under copyright) are currently:
19–21, 32–36 (excluding 34, 35), 39–42, 90, 91, 94, 96, 99–101, and 114.


Posted: Tue Nov 04, 2008 5:49 am
by Carolus
I think the letter is fine overall. My one suggestion is that we should also be seeking Bärenreiter's blessing for the works to be downloadable in the USA (where the status of critical editions is up in the air, though "officially" 95-years from publication (pre-1978) and 70pma (1978 and later volumes). That way, the NMA scores can be tagged V*!N V* for those more than 25-years old, and !N !N !N for those less than 25 years old.

Should we receive such permission, IMSLP would certainly include Sheet Music Plus links for all of the Bärenreiter NMA scores at no charge. (See the page for the Requiem, K.626 to see how these look and work.) This would of course be beneficial for Bärenreiter, given the substantial traffic here.

The letter will have to be reviewed by Feldmahler, of course. It should probably be signed by him as well - though there is probably nothing wrong with including additional signatures.

Posted: Wed Nov 26, 2008 2:02 pm
by aewanko
I'd like to help on this project, pml.

I hope you wouldn't mind me uploading the Series IX (Piano Music) in a matter of time.

Posted: Wed Nov 26, 2008 8:59 pm
by pml
Hi aewanko,

brilliant! If you visit the project page, just put your moniker (i.e. IMSLP username) against several of the volumes. I don't think Matthieu or I have looked at Series IX yet; there is simply too much in Series II that is occupying me at present.

I've been having numerous technical problems downloading from the Mozarteum site of late, so hopefully all will go well for you. I think problems of this nature might strengthen the case for IMSLP to mirror the collection, however it will still require some good negotiation skills on my part :)

Regards, Philip

Posted: Wed Nov 26, 2008 10:29 pm
by aewanko
A question about the uploading format. What would I place in the publisher info and editor? Just clarifying things up.

Posted: Thu Nov 27, 2008 2:00 am
by pml
Uploads: always PDF.

A template has been designed for the purpose, so that the info format to go into the Wiki page should be as follows:

{{MozartNMA|Series|Workgroup|Extra Code info|Volume description|Plate #|Year}}

which will magically do all of the formatting:

e.g. {{MozartNMA| I | 1 | /Abt.1/1 | Abteilung 1: Messen, Band 1 | 4547 | 1968 }} generates the following text:
Neue Mozart Ausgabe, Serie I, Werkgruppe: 1, Abteilung 1: Messen, Band 1 [NMA I/1/Abt.1/1].
Kassel: Bärenreiter-Verlag, 1955–2007, plate BA 4547 (issued 1968)

Neat, huh? :)

There's usually a separate field for the Editor's name, which you will simply find either on the Project Page, or in the prefatory matter to the individual NMA volumes. I will provide birth and death dates where appropriate (i.e., only for the deceased editors, as there are no privacy or consent issues with publishing the deceased's year of birth, which OTOH living authors can get shirty over).

Don't do any uploading yet. Gathering the scores off the Mozarteum website and amalgamating the PDFs in more sensible fashion than they do on their website, is more than enough work for now. There are only currently three of us on the project team (and I wrote an 93,000 word novel last month, and Matthieu is busy with other things).

Festina lente (Hasten slowly).

Regards, Philip

Posted: Fri Dec 12, 2008 3:40 am
by pml
Update, 12 December 2008

Completed: updates to the Project page; created the Neue Mozart-Ausgabe page; and designed the Publication Template.

Note, the page for the Neue Mozart-Ausgabe itself (not the project page) includes a table of the editors, with birth and death years for the deceased: about two-thirds of the various editors are still living, and none of the deceased have had the (Canadian) copyright term of 50 years post mortem auctoris expire. Therefore, none of the editorial prefaces or critical reports from the NMA may be posted.

Next item: Style guide.

The style guide will be written over the coming weekend or the next (December 13/14 or 20/21). I am still looking for potential contributors to sign up: the last I’ve heard from the current small band of contributors is as follows:

PML: volumes 1–16, 18, 25, 26, 28–31, 43–55, 65–79, 94, 95, 100, 102–107, and 111.
Matthieu: 1–3, 46–89, 92 and 93.
Aewanko: 100 and 101.
[sixty-seven PD volumes in total]

Unclaimed: 19–21, 23 (entering PD in 2009), 32, 33, 35–42, 90, 91, 96, and 99 [seventeen in total]

Now that the FTP server is available, it may be possible for Matthieu or myself to share some of the uploading around, as we have the great bulk of works covered.

There is no problem having overlapping responsibility for volumes with other contributors, so long as we cover the full hundred volumes (I’m assuming you’re all adults, and that you can agree in advance to not get in one another’s way). Simply sign up at the Project page and put your Wiki handle in the contributor column.

Please use this link to reach me via e-mail if you have any questions: